PostdocTransformation show for scienctists leaping into business
Get to know companies which hire people with a doctor title!
Episode 0033 Shownotes
Learn from Dr. Rima Dey, an engineer and career elevation coach in India, why upscaling and emotional intelligence is important, not only for STEM professionals. In this PostdocTransformation show episode, she shares valuable insights, practical tips for navigating job interviews and salary negotiations. This episode is packed with valuable career transition resources to help you jumpstart your career leap into business!
We share actionable tips for your PostdocTransformation.
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Eleonore:
Dr. Rima Dey, I'm so happy to have you because like I already said in the introduction, you and I resonate a lot on LinkedIn and just by reading your posts, I think that we share the same values. And that's why I was so excited to have you on my show, you are an engineer in India, having a large community in LinkedIn, what are things that keep an engineer or STEM [00:02:00] professional relevant?
Dr. Rima Dey:
First of all, thank you so much for giving me this opportunity and platform to speak. And yes, as you said, rightly it's the values because of which I think we connected and we resonated so well.
The Importance of Upskilling and Emotional Intelligence in STEM
Dr. Rima Dey:
So, coming back to your question, what are the two important things that would keep an engineer or a STEM professional relevant moving forward right now? This is something I had talked about long back and I always keep iterating the same thing, that the two things that keep STEM professionals so ingenious relevant is number one, upskilling.
You have to be constantly upskilling. Now what does upskilling mean? Because this is the fourth industrial revolution. Every industrial revolution has impacted the way we worked. Okay.
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Impact of Industrial Revolution and AI on Work Culture
Dr. Rima Dey:
And the fourth industrial revolution prior to which covid happened, changed a lot of things where there is remote work becoming more common among people.
Hybrid [00:03:00] work becoming more common. Among people and the use of AI tools being literate with, AI tools no matter what area of work you are in. So, those are the things that you have to upskill to make sure that you are relevant. Irrespective of what you are pursuing in your education or what degree you are getting, that's number one.
Discussion on Emotional Quotient and its Relevance
Dr. Rima Dey:
And number two, the factor that keeps us relevant as humans is our emotional caution. So, everything that connects us, everything that makes us believe that we belong to a community is our emotional caution. And anything right now that differentiates us from the AI is our emotional caution. Now, what does this emotional caution involve?
The Role of Empathy and Relationship Management in Workplace
Dr. Rima Dey:
It involves self-awareness. It involves self-management skills. It involves empathy [00:04:00] skills. It involves managing your relationships because seldom at workplace you will be working alone. This is one skill that you have to get really good at so that you can lead yourself and you can also lead the people around you in a way that they're influenced by you and also inspired by you.
Eleonore:
Oh wow. Thank you so much for this ramping up because I'm a psychologist and the way that you also stress the importance of building relationship with people so that you can influence them and take them with you in the change and in the adaptation.
The Significance of Upskilling for Future Work
Eleonore:
Upskilling preparing for the future of work really is so well aligned with what I also teach my Bachelor and Master's students in Industrial and Occupational Psychology because they are not the engineers, but I always tell them that you have to work with engineers as well because you have [00:05:00] to have the domain expertise. And that's why it's all dovetailing, whatever you said right now.
Discussion on LinkedIn Posts and Recession
Eleonore:
All right, I looked at your LinkedIn profile and I saw also a post that resonated a lot. It was about recession and it might be inspiring in nowadays times, because the future for most of us PhDs who are leaping into business might be unsure. What was most inspiring in your point of view for your community?
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Personal Experiences and Insights on Recession
Dr. Rima Dey:
The post happened during the time when the fans, you know, Facebook, alphabet and Netflix, that fan community of companies were laying off people randomly and I being a part of the last big recession, which was 2009, I had experienced it myself. I was jobless. And in that recession, let me tell you, I landed multiple jobs at two of the most known companies. One was General Electric and one was Honeywell. Okay? [00:07:00]
The Positive Long-term Impact of Recession
Dr. Rima Dey:
So, the inspiration behind that post, which kind of had so many impressions was that even though it's recession, there's no reason to lose hope.
Because while I was working at one of the companies during recession as an intern, I saw my team lead being sacked off. And she was no way less competent or less professional. No, you had no reasons, but you just had no space to accommodate people, you had to let them go and you didn't have any solid reasons.
And once these people left the company, I saw them making it to better places. She moved countries into a higher role, which was much more suited for what she was supposed to do. Okay? So that was the inspiration that recession, it's will hurt you in the short run, but in the long term, if you think about it, it might take you to [00:08:00] better places.
That's what happened to me and that's what happened to people around me. So that's the point of creating that post. And in fact, when I was digging into it, Harvard did some research and they also found that most of the professionals who were hit during recession by either losing their job or downgraded to a lower level, all of them did better in the long run.
Discussion on Career Transition and Adaptability
Eleonore:
That really is encouraging for most of us because I can absolutely relate to that. I was also finishing 2008 and started a new job in IT because I needed the money. When you are flexible enough, when you are adaptive and you are resilient and open to change, I think that this is one of the best learning curves that you can have because you have to learn. You have to run with the flow and capitalize on whatever you have. You don't have many chances, but you have to take them all. And that's why it helps you shape your own personality [00:09:00] and to shape your own growth mindset.
Dr. Rima Dey:
Absolutely, Elli and on that note, because you said you have to capitalize on the limited resources that you have during recession, that's the reason you also get super duper focused. That's one reason that gets you to the place you want to be at. You start focusing on yourself and start. Focusing on the skills that you can build on, and that's one thing that you can focus on because that's in your control.
Everything else during recession is not in your control.
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Eleonore:
That really is the perfect bridge to the next part of questions that I wanna ask. So, switching gears from the mindset and the attitude of how to tackle the challenges. And now we wanna look at the operations. So, I also saw on your website, also on LinkedIn, you are posting a lot about tactics in interviews .
You are a LinkedIn pro, so how can a new PhD in stem, in engineering or whatever, leaping into business, how can that person sort of like pimp up or power up the LinkedIn profile.
The Importance of LinkedIn Profile for Job Search
Dr. Rima Dey: Elli, to your question, when it comes to powering up the LinkedIn profile, the very first question we need to ask ourselves is, why do I want to [00:11:00] be on LinkedIn? Is it for business or is it for job? Is it for internship? So I have to be very clear over there because once I know that, why am I here?
I can align my profile accordingly. Okay, so once you get the answer to that, the next thing that you have to do is you have to work on your LinkedIn profile. Now, why you have to work on it, because I say LinkedIn is your online office, so every time that you are wanting to work with the business or work with the company, the very first thing you go and do is Google about that company or Google about that business.
And if, whatever shows up in the search doesn't really impress you, then you have already made up your mind somewhere that this is not impressive enough. I don't want to work with this person. Okay, so you want to ensure over there that your LinkedIn profile is right, because if you Google yourself. The very first thing that's going to show up is your LinkedIn profile, whether [00:12:00] you like it or not.
And so what stops you from believing that the employers, the companies that you're wanting to get into, are not looking for that, not looking for your profile, are not searching you? So. Your profile better be a good one that impresses people, that makes people believe that. This is the person who can provide solutions for the problems that I am encountering right now.
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Eleonore:
I couldn't agree more. All right. Now I have the best LinkedIn profile that I can do with my capabilities, with my skills and everything. Now, if I apply for a job, let's pretend that I'm already invited. What can I now expect in an interview? Is there anything that I can prepare, typical questions or what do you think?
Dr. Rima Dey:
Now, the good news here is that you have been invited because the recruiters or the hiring body taught that you are a qualified candidate who needs to be interviewed. [00:13:00] So, tell yourself that, that you are the candidate who is eligible for this post, and starting from there, pep yourself up and now start the preparation.
Now, when it comes to interview preparation, we have to understand here is a process where they're confirming your impression of the hirers, which they picked up from your resume and LinkedIn. So, when they got your resume, when they saw your LinkedIn profile, they must have picked up some vibes about this candidate, and that's the reason they decided to have you in the interview.
Now interview is another layer where you get to interact with these interviewers. Personally where you have to show them that how you bring value to the table and how good are your soft skills, how good are your hard skills, and then you have to talk in terms of your transferable skills as well.
Okay, so this is one thing the PhD community, people who are looking to [00:14:00] undergo a career transition are missing out on. They're not aware of the transferable skills that they have. So, this is one thing I would like the PhD STEM professionals to think about.
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Dr. Rima Dey:
I'll just provide a quick example so that the community can relate to it better.
Say, you're applying for a research scientist role. Now you have to understand what does this research scientist do? This research scientist has to do extensive literature survey, has to do ex extensive landscaping to understand where the technology gap is, has to coordinate with the external and internal stakeholders, has to convince them why the proposed solution [00:16:00] or the plan that. They have come up with is a viable one . And then in the meantime, they also have to do the experiments, come up with a plan, which is kind of showing your problem solving skills, and then coordinate with the team as well,?
So, you see there's a mix of soft skills and there is the transferable skills, like the literature survey you have been doing in your PhD. Then there are project management skills that are coming here. Although you have not been aware of the term during your PhD, but that's what you have been doing throughout your PhD as an independent contributor.
You have been managing your whole PhD by your own self coordinating with people. So, that's where the transferable skills comes in. And finally, the hard skills. Now this research scientist may have to adept at using some instruments relevant for getting the data or generating the data. Now, as a PhD, you have to be acquainted with that instrument in case if [00:17:00] you are not, then what is the closest match of that instrument that you have used?
Talk about that and how you can learn about it at the earliest. So, these are things you have to be aware of how to talk in the interview so that even if you are not a direct fit, you know how to position yourself and show what value you bring to the table.
We try to discount the skills we already have without realizing how valuable they are. So the discussion here is testament to the fact that we need those skills and do not discount anything.
Sit down, reflect back, and think about the skills that you have developed in the past couple of years.
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Eleonore: Absolutely. And discounting and counting is the bridge to the next question you also have something to say about salary negotiating, and I would love to hear your own voice about that.
Tips for Effective Salary Negotiation
Dr. Rima Dey:
Elli, to keep it sweet and simple, I will start with three simple tips that you can use in your salary negotiation. The number one is never be in any [00:18:00] hurry to negotiate your salary. Okay, now negotiation is a power dynamics game, so you need to have a stand from which you can negotiate.
And that stand comes when the employers want you and nobody else. And that happens when you make them like you more than they thought they would, right? So that likability comes throughout the hiring process, and you gain that stand towards the end of the interview when the offer needs to be finalized.
So, that is when you negotiate your salary and it in the beginning, you always show that you're flexible to the salary negotiation part. Okay? The second thing, when you're going into salary negotiation, I share this with my community, remember the three Ds? Okay? Now the three Ds is, number one is the desire.
Number two is the demand, and number three is the departure. So what are these [00:19:00] three Ds about? Desire. It is a salary that you wish you had, but you're still not comfortable talking about this. So, make a note of that.
Number two is your demand. Now, this is a salary that you can easily demand because you are so confident of the value that you bring to the table.
And the number three is depart. Now, this is a salary below which you are not available for this role.
So, when you have these three pieces of the negotiation together, you will have so much clarity about what you want from this negotiation.
And with that, let's move to your research.
Okay. Just like we do our research in our PhD to be sure about what kind of results we are bringing forth, whether they're valuable or not, and how they contribute in the whole knowledge pool that is already there. Similarly, when you do your research, you are aware of the salary ranges for a particular role.
You have [00:20:00] spoken to people in the industry, that gives you so much confidence to negotiate your stand and negotiate your number. So, these are the three golden rules I keep sharing always.
Eleonore:
Oh, that really was eye-opening in the sense that you have sort of like the three lanes within you should navigate: desire, demand, and depart. And I think that is also giving you a good feeling of entering the negotiation so that you know, you have to stand for yourself in the negotiation because no one else will. And then they will sort of like push you somewhere here or there, but you still have your numbers in mind and that will help you to be decisive and depart if needed.
Dr. Rima Dey:
And Elli, on that note, I just wanted to add that negotiation is also [00:22:00] showing leadership skills. You know, it's very easy to not negotiate, but it's very tough to negotiate. You just don't have to negotiate your salary moving forward. You'll have to negotiate with clients, you'll have to negotiate with stakeholders.
Where do you go? Then you cannot escape. So, this is a life skill that will help you throughout your life as well as your career.
Eleonore: Absolutely agreed, now I wanna switch gears again and talk about your free and also your paid career transition resources. So, on your website, I saw that you have sort of like the career mapping tool.
I saw that it's for stem, is it only for stem? Tell me a little bit more about that.
Dr. Rima Dey:
Okay, Elli. Well it is for stem, but it applies to everybody because the strategies across search remain almost the same. There's not much difference. and the free resources that are there on my website is firstly to understand why you are stuck in your job search.
Why you're not landing the kind of offers that you're [00:23:00] wanting to. So, it's a 10 question career mapping tool. You can take that assessment so it'll get you started and it'll initiate you into thinking what are the things you need to work on? Primarily to elevate your job search process. And the other tools that are available is how to make a stellar LinkedIn profile.
So, that's PDF document that is available for free. And the third one is the negotiation part, which so many of us struggle with. And it's, fully laid out, wonderfully written PDF document as to how you can start your negotiation with a recruiter without losing your stand or without giving away your number right at the beginning.
Eleonore:
That is exciting and I will surely look into the PDFs as well. How can I work with you? Is there anything that you can share with us?
Dr. Rima Dey:
Absolutely, Elli. I had this webinars through which I was [00:25:00] getting students into my community earlier, and this was more of a cohort based community, but right now I've gone into more one-on-one coaching sessions. So, you can connect with me on LinkedIn and DM on LinkedIn if you're interested. And there we can get on with you for a complimentary 30 minute session to understand where you are stuck and how can I get you unstuck.
And if we find each other to be the right fit, then we can get started right there.
The coaching session that I provide are a mix of e-course and one-on-one coaching that happened parallelly, there are eCourses, there are resources, there are templates that you will have for lifetime in addition to the one-on-one coaching that you will be having with me till you make the transition or the new job that you want to land, the one-on-one sessions will continue. In addition, you'll have a community of people that have benefited from these courses, which will help you to build a [00:26:00] network, which you might not have immediately to start with as a fresher PhD or as a STEM professional.
Have you found this episode so far helpful for yourself? Well, maybe you can subscribe on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Podbean, or wherever you get our show. And also, share this episode with your PhD bestie because that would encourage us to help the underprivileged, underrepresented, and underserved early career scientists leaping into business.
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Eleonore:
And I think what is also remarkable looking at your offer is that you have also an offer for freshers and also for leaders thinking, what's the next step in my career? So with [00:27:00] these words, I would love to end this. And is there anything that you wanna share before we sign off?
Conclusion and Final Thoughts
Dr. Rima Dey:
I want to share: you may be the best one with the best educational degree, you may have all the right skills and the right attitude. You may have a great performance history, yet you can fall prey to recession. You can fall prey to a bad boss. You can fall prey to a bad company culture.
Those are things not in your control. So if that happens, then understand this is how the whole process is. It's very cyclic. There will be good and bad phases. The only thing is to show up in whatever phase you are.
Eleonore:
Thank you for your time, Rima, and I hope that my listeners, the PostdocTransformers, will also follow you on LinkedIn and connect with you because you have so much more to share. And the first part of this episode, we talked about your LinkedIn posts that resonated most, and [00:28:00] I will make sure to link all of these in the show notes so that my listeners can also find them and dig deeper into that. I hope that they will also find your free career transition resources and also your paid career sources, because I really think that we have great coaches on our show, but we need to resonate with the one that really moves and inspires us. If you connect with Dr. Rima Dey, please let her know and say hi from me, thank you.
Dr. Rima Dey:
Thank you Elli.
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